From Performance to Surrender with Cat Samuel

Show Notes

CortneyJo welcomes back her dear friend Cat Samuel to share her inspiring journey of faith and identity. After achieving her dream of attending the University of Michigan with the Gates Millennium Scholarship, Cat’s life took unexpected turns through heartbreak, loss, and seasons of instability. A powerful encounter with God shifted her view from distant Creator to personal Lord, leading her to Missouri, then North Carolina, where true community and discipleship reshaped her faith. Today, Cat shares how moving from performance to surrender, embracing spiritual disciplines, and trusting God’s slow, steady work has transformed her life for His glory.

Episode Highlights:
(3:03) The early days of Cat’s faith and identity journey

(6:22) How Cat got everything she wanted, but then it all changed

(12:08) Going from seeing God as a distant creator to personal Lord

(19:43) Cat’s move to North Carolina following a stormy season of life

(22:31) Her stormy season of life continues

(30:39) The role that community played in Cat’s healing and growth

(36:46) What she would say to women who feel caught in performance

(44:01) What being a M.U.C.H. Woman means for Cat today

Links Referenced:

Celebration of Discipline: https://www.amazon.com/Celebration-Discipline-Path-Spiritual-Growth/dp/1596444541

Transcript

Cat: By the time I reached that church, it was almost like I’m just going to do what I see everyone else doing. So, whatever Christian looked like is what I began to do. I was just like, I’m just going to look like everyone else, and maybe I’ll get it right or maybe it’s just going to be a struggle like this. And it really came crashing down when I had two deaths [laugh]. We talked about, before with you, a death of a relationship. I had a death of a marriage, and then my mom passed away. And so, with all of that weight, it was just, like, the performance that I was putting on, that didn’t cut it anymore. And so, all of those things started crashing down.

CortneyJo: Welcome to the I am MUCH Woman podcast, where we inspire and guide women to deepen their personal relationship with God and to grow in their understanding of His Word. Welcome back, MUCH Woman podcast family. We are so glad that you are joining us again for episode nine. And today is extra special for me because I get to sit down with one of my most favorite people in my life, one of my best friendgirls who I love so dearly and so deeply. And you all remember her, Cat. She’s my, one of my bestest friends in the whole world, Cat Samuel.

If you’ve been listening for a while, you’ll remember Cat from our friendship episode back in November, which touched so many hearts. And after that episode, several of you reached out asking to hear more from her, and today we’re doing just that, and I couldn’t be more grateful to have you, Cat, here. Cat’s journey with God is just one of deep transformation, from performance to pain to intimacy and identity. And today, we’re going to explore all of that journey, all of it more fully. And Cat, I’m so excited to talk to you about this today. Thank you so much for being here, and we’re going to just dive right in. How are you—by the way—today?

Cat: I am here—I appreciate your audience, wanting to hear more of the story. I’ve been reflecting on my testimony and journey, and so I am really excited to be able to share what God has done in my life. As I was thinking about it, I was just like, man, this is not just my story; this is what the Lord has done. This is his story in my life. And so yes, I’m excited to share.

CortneyJo: Thank you so much. Well, I’m excited for everyone to hear it because this is an incredible story. And I know we’re all still on our journeys, but looking forward to just learning more about where you’ve come from and where you are today. So, how about we just start from the beginning, Cat, and let’s discuss the early days of your faith and identity journey. I remember you sharing with me how you had this dream to attend the University of Michigan since you were in the fourth grade, and that dream came true. So, tell us about that season of your life. What were your hopes, and what did the world look like at that time for you?

Cat: As you say, since I was in elementary school, fourth grade, I didn’t know all of the details. I was like, I want to go to Michigan, the school with the yellow and the blue. I soon found out that it’s maize and blue, and [laugh] you need to be correct about that [laugh]. And yeah, always wanted to go to University of Michigan. I kind of had plans for what life would look like really early on, and even though I didn’t know how I would get there, what academics were needed in the very beginning, or even the financial need, as I got older, that became more and more apparent to me.

But I was still determined, no matter what. I even remember saying that, like, even if I have to take out all student loans, I’m going [laugh]. And so, I worked academically, and with extracurricular activities, and all of those things to reach that goal. My goal, while I was there, was to get ready for marriage as well [laugh]. I always wanted to be a wife and a mom, and so I figured that would happen somewhere around that time as well.

And so, I had those plans in the forefront of my mind. And so, all of my hopes and dreams were really wrapped around going to my dream school. And lo and behold, my last year, or maybe a little bit into my junior year, you know, I was applying for scholarships and things like that. I was actually an independent student when I enrolled in college, and so I started applying for scholarships based off of that status. And I was able to be awarded the Gates Millennial Scholarship, and that paid for everything. So, [laugh] that was one of those weights—yeah, it was amazing.

I applied, there was—it was, like, such an easy thing, and it felt like such an open door that I was ready to walk right into it because I was willing to do anything to go there, and I didn’t have to worry about that financial aspect. And I had already been working on everything else, academically, and with working, and extracurricular things, and even volunteering. I was just like, what do they want to see on the application? They want great writers. I increased my writing skills and things like that.

So, everything that I had was hinged around going to university. I also, at that time, had started a relationship, and that was, you know, towards the end of my high school year. So before, I thought maybe I would meet my husband in college, but then I felt like I had met my husband in high school, and that we were going to, you know, finish out our college days at universities not far away from each other. And so, I was just really, yeah, looking forward to it. Life was looking up [laugh].

CortneyJo: Like, this is it. So, this was a time when you feel like everything was lining up. You had the dream school, dream relationship, the Gates Millennial Scholarship that paid for everything at your dream school. What a blessing. But then, as I know—because I know your story—then things suddenly shifted. So, what happened? And tell us how that affected you.

Cat: You know, I enroll in college, you know, I’m there—I’m in the dorms, actually—in courses and things like that, and also, like I said, I was in a relationship that I felt like, honestly, I integrated my life into this other person’s life [laugh]. And so, I felt like this was my family. Those are the next steps that we were going to have. And I believed that we were going to, you know, have a long relationship together. But soon after getting started in the semester, even though we had—he was a little bit older than me—and so we had some time where he was in college, and then now I was in college, and I thought that was going to be like even better because, like, neither one of us are in our homes [laugh]; we’re kind of on our own, at that point. You kind of feel like that when you go to college, like, you’re getting a taste of what it’s like to be on your own.

I thought this was going to be a more freeing time for us in our relationship. We’d be able to spend more time together and stuff like that. But then that ended up leading to a breakup. And I was devastated, literally devastated. And I remember going to my friends, my college friends at that time, and I was just so lost.

And they were like, Cat, you are at the University of Michigan. This is the greatest school. Everybody drank the Kool-Aid on that being the best school ever. And so everyone, we were just like, you are in a great place right now. Just that one little piece is the only thing that’s missing. They were trying to pick me up.

And they said, go out, have fun, party, date. And I was like, date? Like, you know, I had some guys that I had dated before the relationship that I was in that led to the breakup, but I had never been out, like, dating, and partying, and stuff like that. So, their advice—that was the advice that they gave to me, was to go ahead and do those things. And I tried [laugh]. I tried, I tried to go out there.

And there was a lot of failures, a lot of bump—my head got bumped a lot [laugh] in those ups and downs, and in the—not so, like, a hard party life, but just the going out, and you know, exploring new things. It was just a lot of bumps in the road. And it was definitely a place of me feeling lost. And I didn’t know what I was doing or where I was going. I also started questioning, like, what am I going to do with my career, you know?

I’m here at the university, and I had spent so much time kind of wrapped up in that relationship that it didn’t matter really what I graduated with, what my degree program I was pursuing, or anything like that. But now I was faced with those questions, and I feel like I needed to answer them right then and there. And so, I was having a crisis in that area as well. So, it was almost like one crisis led to the other. And so, in the midst of feeling lost and having all of those bumps, I met someone, and the friend was telling me about a God.

And so, I had grown up in church. I spent almost all of elementary—I didn’t go all of elementary, but pretty much the end of elementary, middle school, and high school, in the church, but I had never—like, for some reason, it just felt like it was a social club. It was a place to [laugh] make good contacts in the community. I got a lot of scholarships from the connections that I had in my local church. In addition to the Gates Millennial Scholarship, I had other scholarships, too.

And I also had job opportunities and things that I did that kind of elevated me and status in my community because of my church connections, but I never really understood the God aspect of it. Honestly, I felt like, you know, that was just for the older people. When you get older, then that’s what you do. You go ahead and you talk about God a lot, but the understanding of Jesus Christ or anything like that, I didn’t really understand that totally. And so, this friend starts telling me about a God that is one that engages in your life, that he is one that answers your prayers.

And so, I started getting, like, questioning, like, what have I been sitting in church, learning about? What are we—what’s going on here? And so, when that happened, I started looking differently and thinking differently, just a little bit [laugh].

CortneyJo: That’s really powerful. And what a special friend in college, you know, to say—because, I mean, you know, college is such a time where we are, you know, trying to figure things out, so it sounds like this friend had some understanding, you know? This particular friend was like, listen, there’s a God out here, and he actually hears you and hears your prayers.

Cat: There was one thing that I was going to add to that. I think that my understanding of God was that he just set the world in motion and just kind of let it go. So, that was my belief in God at that time. So, the fact that there was a God that would engage with me was what was intriguing to me at that moment.

CortneyJo: That’s interesting, like, it’s like he’s Creator; that’s it, right? That’s how you felt. Like, he was this Creator, and then after that, just free fall [laugh] and, like, he’s not really in the picture. I understand that. So, once you had the understanding or someone sharing with you, he does actually listen, he listens to you, he hears your prayers, he wants to be in a relationship with you—you as an individual—how did that moment change you, like, going from just only seeing him as just Creator to personal Lord?

Cat: Absolutely. So, that was the time—so my—there was like an awakening that happened in my mind, and my eyes opened up. There was, I can’t say, a complete veil was lifted, but it was just like my mind started thinking a little bit differently. And so, in the midst of that, I came up with a plan [laugh]. And so, my plan was to lock myself in my room and pray until this God answered me.

And so, I think in my mind, I was like, going to hold Him hostage. Like, I got this little bit of information from a friend, and I held on to it because I was just—I think I wanted it to be true, and so I was just, like, I’m going to stay in my room, and if there’s a God that is real that hears you and answers prayers, well I’m going to, like, bet[laugh]. I’m going to lock myself in my room and I’m going to stay here day and night until I hear an answer. I don’t know if I had a time frame on how long I was going to stay in that room, but I was determined.

And so, I did that. At the top of the day—and I know it was morning time—but I decided to start praying, and because I had never prayed before, I immediately fell asleep [laugh]. And so, yeah, there wasn’t a lot of praying that happened. It was mostly sleeping [laugh].

CortneyJo: You may have needed some rest. Yeah.

Cat: Maybe, maybe. But how good and gracious God is, I felt like when I went to sleep, like, I had a dream, and in that dream, I felt like God had met me there in my dream, and he was giving me directions for my life. And there was not a lot of details, but it was enough for me to realize, like, okay, I need to follow Jesus. Like, that was the answer. It was just, like, he showed up in my dream, and when I woke up, I said, “Jesus is God. He’s the king, and I need to follow him.” [laugh].

So immediately, I got up, and I felt so convicted that, like, I told all my family and my friends, and they looked at me with the weirdest faces [laugh]. They couldn’t quite understand what I was talking about, what reference point I was coming from. And so, I told them I was like, I feel like in this dream, God wants me to follow him, and I feel like that a part of that means that I need to leave. I can’t stay here anymore, and I need to go to another state. I felt like at that time, it was Missouri.

And so, that was totally opposite. And my friends and family continued—their jaws were dropping deeper and deeper as I’m telling the story. One that I’m saying that I woke up and God spoke to me. That’s like, “What?” And then the next level was that he wants me to leave my dream school, and then go to another school that I had never even heard of before.

And so, everyone’s just like, “This is crazy, Cat.” No one agreed with me. No one understood where I was coming from, but I was so determined that I needed to do it. And I felt like they needed to pray and ask God for direction for their life, too. They didn’t want to listen to that either, but I just said, “Well, I have to go.”

And so, I packed up, [laugh] I got, like, a rental truck. It wasn’t U-Haul, but it was like a Penske, is what the company that was out that I packed all of my stuff up. I had an apartment. I had just gotten a new apartment with friends. Like, there was a lot of things that should have, like, kept me there, but I was so determined that I packed everything up, all of my furniture that I had, and I put it in the moving truck, and I started heading to Missouri. I enrolled in school. I immediately got in because I had that Gates Millennial Scholar, and I don’t think anyone gets rejected, [laugh] if they say they have all of that money.

CortneyJo: Yes, oh well. I’m sure your academics spoke for themselves, as well.

Cat: Yes. I did okay. So yeah, those entrance into the next school was a very easy process. And I always just felt like it was God. I was just, like, God has allowed this to happen. God allowed me to drive there, all the way, by myself. And even as I entered into, almost into the city of where my school was going to be, I felt like a confirmation that this is exactly what I needed to do.

And so, during that time, I tried to pursue God, but I had no context. So, I remember, I felt like I needed a Bible [laugh]. And I went to the local Bible store and I picked out a Bible. It was a big, huge Bible. It was like, probably one that had, like, lots of commentary in it, but I figured, like, the bigger, the better, the more information I could.

And then I also saw a Strong’s Concordance. And so, I remember opening up my Bible, and the Strong’s Concordance, and like, just staring at it confused. I didn’t know how to read the scriptures, how to understand what was being said. It was like I was the Ethiopian that Philip met on the road [laugh]. I was like, I have no idea what I’m reading. I need someone to explain it to me.

And so, I knew that I should be reading the scriptures, but I didn’t know how to. And so, that was kind of like a [ehh], you know? What do I do here? And then I started going to, you know, some churches that friends had invited me to. I knew I should go to church, but I didn’t quite connect with the people at the church, and so that was a little [ehh][laugh]. How do I do this? How do I live this out?

And so, there was a lot of elements to my faith that I didn’t understand how to live it out. And because of that, I felt like God still loved me, he still cared for me, and if I prayed, he would answer, but I didn’t know how to live out the Christian faith. And so, many times I would just—I eventually found a church that was probably a better place for me to be at, but by that time, by the time I reached that church, it was almost like I’m just going to do what I see everyone else doing. So, whatever Christian looked like is what I began to do. I was just like, I’m just going to look like everyone else, and maybe I’ll get it right or maybe it’s just going to be a struggle like this. And it really came crashing down when I had two deaths [laugh]. We talked about, before with you, a death of a relationship. I had a death of a marriage, and then my mom passed away. And so, with all of that weight, it was just, like, the performance that I was putting on, that didn’t cut it anymore. And so, all of those things started crashing down. And yeah, that was a really hard time. When I think back on it, yeah.

CortneyJo: Yeah, yeah. So, you moved from Michigan to Missouri. You had this beautiful encounter with the Lord, moved from Michigan to Missouri, and just for our listeners, for context, you did end up getting married. You met someone else, and you did get married. But then experienced, then the death of your mom, and then the death of that marriage.

So, it’s like, now you’re in Missouri, where you feel like you’re supposed to be, and then you have these other things come crashing down, and you’re also trying to be this Christian, right? Like I’m trying to look like everyone else, I’m trying to—because I don’t really understand, I haven’t really been really taught how to do this, so I’m just going to kind of follow the examples that’s before me, and I’m just going to fit that mode. And that’s what you did. So, [sigh] oh, so after that, Cat, so you’ve now experience this… heart-wrenching death of your mom, you have this death of a marriage. Where are you in this moment? So, what’s happening now? Where are you in that moment?

Cat: I’m in crisis mode, for sure. Life feels like a crazy storm. It’s like a hurricane coming in. My sister, you know, she’s also going through the death of our mom as well. We’re kind of going through that together, and so we decided to be closer together to support each other. And so, she picked that we moved to North Carolina.

And so, I said, “I will go wherever you want to go, so that we can be closer together to help each other during this time.” So, me—and at this point, I have two girls, two little girls; they are adults now, but they were two little girls at the time—and we traveled to North Carolina. I also had another family member that came with us as well, a cousin of ours, and he was kind of looking out for us, like, big brother a little bit. And so, we moved to North Carolina.

And yeah, but then I continued in… still the. Feeling God is, he’s still my Savior, and he’s still the one who is looking out for me and answering my prayers. I can read my scripture a little bit more. I won’t say that I was totally unaware of how to read at that point, but there’s still a lot of missing elements. And then with, you know, the circumstances of life weighing on me, it was definitely like a Four Soils experience. There was a lot of things that would come and get snatched from me, and the cares of the world would come and sway away very easily.

CortneyJo: Mm-hm, yeah. So, you know, because I know your story, and I know that, you know, after you moved to North Carolina, I remember you telling me that you described your life at the time is, like, this just felt like a hurricane season of life, like, things is just swirling, swirling, you know? Can you tell us more about that season?

Cat: I ended up meeting my husband now, [laugh] and I say he was like a part of the welcome committee of North Carolina because he was the first person that I met [laugh]. And so, I do have another relationship that’s starting in the midst of that. I also have the girls that I am raising. But because I am not rooted and grounded in my faith, I. We made more bad decisions. This time, making bad decisions together.

We were married, and we found ourselves homeless. Like, we were—our credit, we just left a rental history of a wreckage behind us. When we moved from one place to the next, we were not responsible over, you know, the resources that God had given to us. And so, even though we were both employed at the time, like, we had a hard time finding, like, a residence, a place to lay our head. And so, we were doing from extended-stay hotels, and even staying on couches, couch surfing, and stuff like that, it was just kind of a bad time as far as, like, not being responsible.

Even while working, like, you know, there were things that we could have done that we did not, to get us into a right place. But I remember, actually one day, it was my birthday, and my husband was trying to make the best of it because we’re in an extended-stay hotel. And let me tell you, I don’t know if you’ve stayed in one of those environments before, but like, I can hear people up and down the hall, there’s bugs, you know, that people brought from other places, creeping and crawling around your stuff, and you’re trying to duck and dodge those things. And so, this particular one had, like, a kitchenette, and so Brandon is there, trying to cook a great meal for me, and he is got a cupcake. And I remember, like, being on Facebook and posting a picture of the cupcake, and trying to find the right angle to make sure [laugh] you can only see the cupcake. You know, I’m definitely curating this photo.

And this is actually before the ultra-curating that we see on social media right now, so I feel like I was feeling like that pressure to not be as real as life was at that moment, in front of Facebook. And so, if someone’s on Facebook and they were friends, I’m not on there a lot, but that picture is still there. If you want to go back and see that moment that I’m talking about, I see it’s still there in my timeline from that year. I took that picture, and it was a little cupcake, and it said “Happy Birthday” on it. And I took that picture, and I looked at the picture, and then I looked at my life, and I said, this isn’t the same. The picture is showing something that is not my reality.

And I, at that moment, realized, like, and I don’t have to be here. I had a moment, it was like, I’m the daughter of a king [laugh]. Why am I living like a pauper? And so, at that moment, my eyes just really opened up, and I was just like, something has to stop. Something has to change. Nothing but God, again.

At that very time, I scrolled, and I’m thinking those same thoughts, but I look and I see a church that’s opening up around the corner from this extended-stay hotel, and I tell Brandon, I said, “We’re going to church Sunday.” [laugh]. And it’s actually our anniversary, our wedding anniversary because our anniversary and my birthday are not far away. And he was just like, “What? Church?” [laugh]. And he’s like, “And it’s our anniversary. What are you saying?”

I’m like, “We have to go to church. We do. We have to.” And from that point on, I started going to church, and that church did not allow me to continue in my present state [laugh]. They would not let me do church mode. They would not let me just put on a Christian face. I had to get real with them. And so, I started attending, like, prayer meetings, and I got involved in a community there.

I actually had um, a mentor or a discipler. She took me under her wing, and like, she taught me how to read the scriptures. And, oh my goodness, my whole world, it opened up. It was just, like, your mind being renewed, your mind being transformed by the Word of God. It was like night and day.

It was such a crazy and blessed experience. Like… I didn’t know that was available for me. So yeah, sorry. All of this is so emotional [laugh]. Also during that time… I feel like the Lord, like, just really showed me that there’s a place that I can go with Him in prayer. And I called it this, and I didn’t know it was a thing, but it was like, this is our secret place. This is a place where you can meet the Lord in prayer and you can commune with Him, and that was transformational as well.

CortneyJo: Amen, Cat. And we both—I know we both should have had our Kleenex, so once the camera pans on me again, just see [laugh] all this mascara coming down. Thank you for sharing that. I really appreciate this part of your story. I really love the piece of the discipling, that you met someone in your church that said, “Let’s sit down and let’s study these scriptures together, and not only that, let me answer any questions that you may have. And if there’s some questions that I can’t answer, you know, we’ll get the answers. Let’s deep-dive together.”

And I really love that, and I feel like that is a really critical piece, Cat, in any person’s life, you know, who’s wanting to follow Christ, and him being Lord, you know, over in their lives is being able to have that kind of community or someone to be able to support them as they’re learning. And not just simply—and I want to make sure I explain that—that it’s not just simply, you know, you’re going to church on Sunday mornings, you’re listening to the pastor give this incredible sermon, and you’re learning some good stuff. It’s like going a little bit deeper, you know, having that opportunity. Whereas, if you’re in a small group—a small group is great, too, that’s a great way but even taking that small group to that next level, like you did, to the one to one, where you were able to get with this lady, which I think is so beautiful about your story, and I think it’s a really helpful way to better understand.

And then because of that, you were then—you got to this place where it’s like, the Lord was like, “Hey, did you know, we can have this secret place together, and you can come and pray,” and he just made it incredibly personal. I love that, so thank you for sharing that, and I’m so glad that you experienced that in your life, Cat. And so, what role—the question I have for you is, what role has community played in your healing and your growth? Because you, you know, you’ve chatted with us about a lot that you’ve experienced a lot of different scenarios, different things to grieve. So, from grief, healing needs to take place. How has community helped you in that?

Cat: Yeah, I’m happy that you pointed out that I had different levels of community all happening at the same time. You know, I had the joining of the congregation, the brothers and sisters in faith on Sundays, and you know, other opportunities that we had together. So, I wasn’t disengaged from that, and there was an element to that as well that helped me in my growth. But then als—but I feel like I kind of understood that in the first season of my life, I kind of grasped that area, but it wasn’t until I got the second and third layers, which were the community, like the small group, which were more like joining together and praying for each other, a little more in detail than maybe you would say in the general assembly and things like that. And so, it was an opportunity to have brothers and sisters speaking to you from different age groups, and different cultural backgrounds, and economic perspectives.

So, that was good as well, and that was what was happening in more of a small group scenario. And that helped me see the Lord in many ways that, like, he was revealing himself through all these individual people from their experiences and how they had grown in the Lord. They were all in different stages of their walks as well, so that gave me a better glimpse into God’s work in others’ lives. And so, that was a testimony of hope and faith, and also, knowing that God is good in every scenario you may find yourself in because it was diverse of what I was looking at in my small group.

And then also in that one-on-one discipleship, I got a chance to see very intimately, like, what does healing look like? Like, my mentor shared with me her journey and was very vulnerable with me, you know, the things that she struggled with. Now, were her struggles the exact same as mine? Absolutely not but the journey, and how the Lord was faithful in leading her through it, and how she leaned on him, and how she leaned on her other community was that what I was able to gather, and to model, and try to live out in my own life. So, that was amazing.

And she also not just opened up vulnerabilities about her past, she opened up about vulnerabilities in—or just struggles, I should say, yeah, the struggles she had currently. So, it wasn’t like, oh, I’ve arrived and look what I’ve learned. No, it’s just like, yeah, these are things that I’ve been through, and I can show you how that journey looked in the outcome, but then these are the things that I’m still currently in process with, with the Lord. And so, having those examples there, um, was great. That, I mean, almost that, in itself, can make someone at least have a understanding of optimism, knowing that Jesus is there with you through it all, and all the way to the end, even in the hurt and the pain.

But also being able to not only hear about it, but to experience it, that helped me know how to apply the things that she did when she was doing in real time. And even though it hurt and it was stumbling, I was doing the same thing. And so yeah, that was really, really good for me. And how to apply the scriptures because, like I said, that goes back to the general community. We were learning the scriptures together. We were reading through the Word together, and then knowing how to apply it was how I experienced that.

And it also gave me the freedom to share my story. I felt like before, I had to hide everything because I was putting on a show, essentially. When it gets down to it was just a performance. It was a show because I was putting on the Christian faith, but seeing others be vulnerable, seeing my mentor be vulnerable, knowing that she was a leader, and it was just like, oh, I can do this too, and it’s okay. And actually there’s healing on the opposite end when you are vulnerable and you share with others as well.

CortneyJo: Amen. Amen. And bless the Lord for this woman in your life and her willingness to serve in that way, you know, to just be vulnerable about the past, be vulnerable about the present, and even probably vulnerable about any fear she may have had, anything she may be scared about for the future, and how that really helped you. Thank you so much for sharing that. I love that.

And it reminds me, just in case, if anyone wanted to kind of see this, like, what this is, how this is modeled. It reminds me of the movie The Forge. And I know you and I were talking about The Forge, and in there, it talks about discipleship in that community of—and particularly in that movie, it’s about a gentleman and Priscilla Shirer is in that movie, so if anyone is trying to connect it—but the main character, he gets a part of a small group, but he also has a mentor in that small group, and so that’s kind of how that’s modeled. So, everything you’re talking about, if someone wanted to see a visual of that, that’s one way they could see a visual of that. I’m so happy you’ve had that experience. So, let me ask you this, for the woman that’s listening, Cat, who feels stuck, or maybe she feels like you felt, caught in performance or afraid to surrender, what would you say to her today?

Cat: Oh, there’s so much I could say. I know for me specifically, just on that performance element, so it was easy to do the Christian faith because that’s kind of how I lived my life, even pre-Christ. It was just if I achieve—and you may have heard that in my story—I achieved. I achieved. I achieved. If I achieved these things in my own strength, then I have proven myself I have my worth, or I have my face, or I have a status.

So, I think the biggest thing for me, and this may be someone else too, was to check my heart, and my motives, and my prayers. Because if you’re already a follower of Christ, I feel like sometimes we can pray prayers to continue in the same patterns of thought. So, I wanted to look good, so my prayers were for God to help me look good [laugh]. And so, I know that that’s where I have to start. I have to start with praying prayers that were literally not my will, but your will be done, even if I don’t look good, at the end of the day, you know, according to the world standards.

I’m not saying anything about righteousness, and holiness, and truth and things like that. I’m just saying according to the world standards, if for some reason I don’t look top-notch or A-plus at the end of the day, it’s okay because I am following the will of God for this situation or these circumstances that I’m in, instead of always requesting for God to make me look good [laugh]. And so, that’s where I had to start. I just kind of had to back up a little bit there.

And also realizing that being caught up in performance can also lead you to, like, come into your ends, come into your being exhausted, being worn out and worn down because you’re constantly trying to, out of your own strength, achieve this, and look like this, and do all of that. And so, when you come to Jesus and you ask for His will, that also means that you need to realize that you have human boundaries, and you don’t have to perform at capacity, and that’s good. God has created us with boundaries. He’s created us with the boundaries of time. Like, I can’t work all day and all night to get something done because I’m a human that needs to sleep, and that’s good [laugh].

And I can’t take care of my kids, and her kids, and his kids, and they kids because I only have so much energy reserve in my body, and that is good. And so, those are some of those things that I think about when it comes to performance, but also realizing that my responsibility is to be faithful, to be a good steward. And also knowing that, like, the faithfulness is a slow process. As you are learning to follow Christ, to follow what is in the scriptures, to be discipled, to disciple others, to be a community, this is a long haul. It’s not something that happens fast.

When I was living in the realm of performance, I could get things done when I wanted to get it done, but that’s not how your walk with Christ looks. It is a slow cooker; it is not a microwave [laugh]. And so, what I saw people looked like on the outside as a Christian was the result of something that happened on the inside that took a long time to get there. And so, instead of me waiting, I wanted to throw that thing in the microwave and be it already. And so, that what’s led to the outer performance that everyone was able to see.

And so, I like to think about, I hear Jesus, and I also, in the scriptures, there’s, like, a lot of talk about agriculture and stuff like that, so I like to think about that a lot. I grew up where we kind of lived off the land. My aunt, so we had two gardens in our backyard. One was not enough. We had one in one area and one in another, and we also had flower gardens.

So, we had vegetable gardens, fruit gardens, we also have flower gardens, so I like to think about agriculture a lot, and I think about how, like, a seed grows. And so, we can’t make the seed grow [laugh]. The only thing that we can do is allow the environment that we are responsible over to be cultivated well and to be taken care of so that it is in the right conditions to grow. So, if I want to look as though—I’m trying to think of some of the things—I wanted to look faithful, or if I wanted to look truthful, [laugh] or look as though I have joy—Joy is a good one. I like that one. Let’s stick with that one.

If I want to have joy in my life, I can’t walk around and just pretend like I’m happy, but I can do the things that lead to me experiencing the joy of Christ. And there is a level of joy that you get just entering into the kingdom, you know, accepting Jesus as your Lord and Savior. But there’s a deep joy that he starts—that you start experiencing the longer you walk with Him. And the only way to get there is to continue to be faithful to the process of letting the seed sit there. And you make sure that the weeds are away; you make sure the birds don’t come and take away the seeds, and you make sure you’ve planted it in the right place, as far as where the sun, and the rain, and so it doesn’t get scorched and things like that.

So, our lives are, like, we’re just cultivating our lives so that we can experience the seed of God’s word inside of us as it grows and it comes to the fruit of joy. When we hear ‘the fruits of the Spirit,’ that’s something that has already been planted, and it took a long time, and now you see the fruit of it. It’s not like you just plaster that fruit right up on top of the tree.

CortneyJo: Amen. I love that. I love that. And I always love thinking about it from an agricultural perspective, and you know, the seed and just making sure you have the right conditions with the people around you and the information you’re taking in. I love that so much.

Well, we are coming to a close of our episode today, and I have been just so grateful to you for just sharing this beautiful story. And you know, as I told you, people have asked to hear, can you tell us a little bit more, Cat, about what you were talking about in November? So, thank you for doing that today. But we can’t close without asking you the question that we ask every guest, Cat. So finally, what does it mean to be a MUCH Woman to you today, especially being on the other side of so much transformation in your own life? What does it mean to you?

Cat: I would say being a MUCH Woman is practicing the stewardship of your life, practicing the management—stewardship is the Bible word, but our modern word is management—we are managing our lives well, we’re managing our time, where we’re managing our relationships, and our gifts, and we’re doing those things according to the Word of God. So, how God has laid out, and created, and designed us, just like we talked about, you know, you only have 24 hours in a day, and most of that is spent sleeping—well, a lot of it [laugh] is spent sleeping; it should be about, like, eight to ten, or something like that, according to our understanding with science [laugh]—and managing that well for God. Like, he created us as humans to live in this earth with the bounds that he’s given us. He’s not giving us 200 years right now. Maybe when you look in the Old Testament, they had a little bit more, but like, you don’t see anybody that’s 200 years old right now, so you only have the amount of time that you have.

In your relationships and how you manage those, making sure that you are caring with others, with the care of the Lord, and your gifts, and your talents. Everything that we have is to bring glory to God, and to edify, and to lift up the sisters and brothers of Christ, to encourage the body of Christ. That’s what we are to use our gifts and our talents for. They’re not meant to be squandered or to be made selfish for your own selfish ambitions.

They are also to care for yourself and for your family. So, there’s no self-neglect, but there’s not an over indulgence in which you are now neglecting your sister and brother in Christ, or those who are lost, who have not met our Savior, you know, or our Creator. And so just, being a MUCH Woman is practicing good stewardship, good management. And then I know I kind of talked about the things that we do to help us get there, and some of the things that currently—well, things that I’ve done in the past, but then also currently I’m working on, and then there’s some that I still need to work on—would be, like, spiritual practices in your life, making sure you have those things in place that lead you closer to stewarding your life well. Like, these things are not your be-all, end-all.

So, when I speak of spiritual practices, some people may think of, like, fasting. And so, fasting is not going to bring you closer, [laugh] like, to your salvation. Jesus is your salvation, but when you fast, you start remembering your limitations. You also start remembering your dependence on the Lord. And other things that I’ve learned to practice such as studying the Word of God, not just reading it and having a devotional, which is great, but, like, really getting into it and understanding what was the context in which, you know, these things were spoken? Who was reading it? How would they have understood and interpreted that? Like really studying the Word.

That was a downfall for me because I didn’t understand that everything that I read in the Scriptures prior was just, like, okay, how do I read this for my understanding? And so, [laugh] the Bible became a selfish ambition because I didn’t understand context and things like that. Practicing Sabbath, making sure you take time to pause and rest because we’re limited. We can’t wear ourselves out. Practicing solitude, which is amazing.

If you can take an hour of solitude, you could take—some people do full days, a half a day. You know, take time for solitude to just quiet your mind, especially during the time where there’s so many people and things speaking to us, trying to lead and guide our head. But when you practice solitude, you learn how to be in the quiet, to hear the Lord. Like, I shared about the quiet place. That is where I hear and I see the Lord.

And then some other things, like confession, [laugh]. That was a part of my discipleship. Practicing confessing your sins, one to another, that is something that brings freedom. And so, we do these things, not because they will be a performance to help us arrive, but they are the thing, they’re part of the cultivation that aligns our heart to God’s Word so that we can hear him more clearly, we can do the work that he has for us in the earth more clearly, so that we can listen to the hearts of our sisters and brothers more clearly. There’s so many things.

Can I share a book [laugh]? I think maybe you’ve shared a book before. So, Celebration of Discipline by Richard Foster. Some people may or may not have heard of that. That’s where I start, where I was first introduced to different things that I can do, too, that aren’t performative—we don’t want to get into performance again—but that helped me align my heart so that I can live out my faith in a way that honors God, myself, and others.

CortneyJo: Okay. Thank you so much for sharing that, and giving us so much, you know, specifics and things that we can kind of, you know, things we can look at and ways we can steward or manage our lives as MUCH Women. Thank you so much for sharing that. And thank you for your obedience to Christ and how you have been stewarding your own life to be the woman that you are today, you know, this daughter of the king, and then also the wife and mom that you are, and then being able to give back to your community. I feel like the best way that we can give to others is if we do give to ourselves, if we allow that work to be done on the inside.

Oh, my God, we can be so much for others when we have taken the time to be so much for ourselves, so thank you for doing that. And I am so grateful that I have been able to be on this journey with you, you know, in the last 20-plus years now. Thank you so much. I’m so glad I’ve been able to watch you, grow with you, learn with you. It’s just been incredible.

And so, I just pray for other MUCH Women out there, praying for those sister-girls that they can get around those other sister-girls that can encourage them in the same way. Like, we’re doing this together. Iron is sharpening iron. We got each other’s back. And so, Cat, your story is beautiful.

And again, thank you for being so open and honest today. Your story, it continues to bless and inspire so many. And again, I’m grateful that I’ve been able to walk this journey with you as you are living out what it means to be a true MUCH Woman. Thank you so much, and I love you. Love you, friendgirl, thank you.

Well. Listeners, thank you so much for joining us today for episode nine, and we hope that Cat’s story has encouraged you, it has challenged you, and reminded you that God, he’s always inviting us deeper. He always is. And so, you can learn everything about MUCH Woman Ministries, and all the podcasts, this particular episode, all the show notes and transcripts of this episode, everything will be on the website at muchwoman.com. You can get all that information there. Thank you so much for joining us today, and we’ll see you next time. Bye-bye.

CortneyJo: Stay updated with the latest episodes of the podcast at muchwoman.com, and tune in on Apple Podcast, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever fine podcasts are available. We look forward to seeing you next time.